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I wanted to know what the people around here do for a living. Do you make money with your art?
One of the main reasons I became a painter was as my profession, I did make enough money in the last 5 years to live well and support myself, without much direct economic help from my parents. It wasn´t so hard because my father taught me a lot about painting and my mother helped me to sell because she already had a lot of experience selling my father´s work.
But my parents separated some years ago, the situation still didn´t settle, and they don´t help me much anymore. It turns out the family unit did have something to do with my stability and now it´s gone. I know what I have to do now, I have to develop my career on my own, but the thing is I don´t really like the art world, the galleries and market. So I´d have to sell myself to sell my work.
In fact, I´m running away from all of it, I don´t really want a career, to be a famous artist or anything like my father and my grandfather. I just want a simple life. I´m living outside the city now. I love nature, I´m growing a garden, and my real goal is sustainability. I wish I didn´t depend on money and the marketplace to live. I know it´s an utopic idea, but I am trying to pursue it giving small steps in that direction.
But I know I need money anyway, and I did put a lot of effort in my paintings. So the real question now is this: how can I sell my paintings and still maintain my lifestyle? or maybe: what else can I do to make money?
Just wanted to take all of this out of my head.
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:iconfelipebatera:
felipebatera Featured By Owner Nov 3, 2008
Eu sou músico. Vivo com a minha família, mas dou aulas, e ganho um pouco de dinheiro com isso. Longe de ser o suficiente pra pensar em me mudar e morar sozinho. Mas é um começo.

Eu achei seus ideais muito legais. Eu também não quero uma carreira artística, ao menos não no sentido da palavra "carreira". Por outro lado, eu espero poder me apresentar sempre e ter minhas peças tocadas. E para isso acontecer, tenho que me embrenhar um pouco nesses ramos, onde os artistas burgueses tentam sobreviver de forma tão ingrata.

Respondendo às suas perguntas, eu acho que você poderia tentar dar aulas particulares de pintura onde vive. Eu acho que dar aulas é um excelente meio de manter um pouco do dinheiro vindo, além de ser divertido. Eu consigo esquecer do mundo quando dou aulas, e isso é realmente ótimo. Você pode tentar dar aulas em colégios por aí também.

Quanto a vender as pinturas... bem, você já tem um canal, que é o da sua mãe. Você pode fazer o que realmente gosta e tentar ver se ela vende, e obviamente deixar um pouco da comissão com ela.

Onde você está morando agora? Eu moro fora da cidade também (SP), em Cotia.

Abraço.
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Nov 19, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
Fala cara, obrigado pelo comentário, desculpe eu ter demorado pra responder.
Eu nunca dei aulas, mas quem sabe essa não seja uma opção.. O problema é que fujo cada vez mais de horários e responsabilidades, e dar aulas requer isso.
Estou morando na Serra da Cantareira... e por aqui me perco nos dias, esqueço do mundo. Comecei a fazer um site sobre as coisas que tenho vivido por aqui, dá uma olhada se quiser: [link]
Meu avô tinha um sítio em Cotia que eu adorava...
Espero que sua carreira musical dê certo.. Minha irmã tb batalha bastante para isso, ela tem uma banda chamada Diafanes, que é bem legal.
Um abraço!
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:iconfelipebatera:
felipebatera Featured By Owner Nov 19, 2008
Opa Tamino.
É curioso como a gente pode conhecer pessoas inteligentes pela internet.
Gostei demais do seu site. Ia inclusive pedir que você colocasse mais fotos das redondezas e dos animais que você encontra por aí.
Aqui em Cotia moro perto da civilização, e não em um sítio mais afastado como você, coisa que me chateia muito. Penso em sair daqui depois que me formar na faculdade e ir morar em um lugar mais afastado, mas que também não seja muito distante da cidade. Vamos ver o que acontece.

Já ouviu Messiaen? Ele foi um compositor francês (e ornitólogo) que ficou famoso por utilizar cantos de pássaros em suas músicas. Eu tenho, inclusive, as peças do "Catalogue d'oiseaux", um catálogo de peças para piano baseadas apenas em cantos de pássaros que ele separou por espécies. A Naxos lançou uma há pouco tempo: [link]
Vale a pena conhecer, já que você parece se interessar bastante.

Aliás, o site de cantos de pássaros que vc colocou no seu site é muito bom, será de grande ajuda.

Bom, quanto a dar aulas... eu recomendo. O que aprendo ensinando é tanto quanto aprendi estudando. Pense sobre isso com carinho. Eu acho que manter algumas responsabilidades faz bem, saca? Acho que manter um contato com o mundo lá fora, mesmo que pequeno, é necessário... mesmo que todos sejam tão burgueses e mesquinhos...

Abraço.
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Nov 28, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
Fala Felipe!

Valeu pelo comentário sobre o site... Dá motivos pra continuar. Vou atualizando ele aos poucos. Aqui não é longe da civilização, mas é um lugar bem arborizado e com muitos terrenos "baldios" com mata, então tem bastante animais, mas conforme a região vai crescendo, as areas naturais vão diminuindo. Os bugios por exemplo precisam de bastante espaço, eles não ficam em uma area só, e é necessário que haja um caminho por onde eles passem de uma area a outra.

Nunca ouvi esse compositor, mas agora que vc mencionou vou procurar, parece ser muito bom mesmo.

Minha namorada sempre fala em dar aulas, ela queria ter uma escola para crianças! hehe mas não é assim tão fácil né.
Mas aqui onde moro até tem um espaço legal onde eu poderia usar para dar aulas... vou pensar a respeito sim, acho que vc está certo em dizer que é melhor não se desconectar totalmente do mundo.
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:iconmistabobby:
MistaBobby Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008   Digital Artist
I wish I could do art full-time. Instead, I work at an inpatient residential psychiatric hospital.
Art is more of a hobby and outlet for creativity for me than anything else, but if I could find a way to make a decent living doing art alone, I certainly would. I know it can be done, but so can winning the lottery.
:devilish:
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 16, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
you work in a psychiatric hospital? it must be hard, but i´m sure you must learn a lot.
nah, winning the lottery is impossible, making a living out of your art can be done.
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:iconmistabobby:
MistaBobby Featured By Owner Oct 17, 2008   Digital Artist
It can be emotionally and physically draining, but it is an awesome experience (usually). And yes, both winning and the lottery and making a living out of art are both possible... in theory. :)
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 17, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
my father and my grandfather are examples of people who live from their art. i don't know anyone who won the lottery and never will.. that tells me something. the odds are completely different. in art you can actually make it happen, but you can't make yourself win the lottery.
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:icontangledweb:
tangledweb Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008  Professional General Artist
I practice architecture, which I love and do photography on the side...which I thoroughly enjoy...though I don't really make much money from it, enough to sustain the habit. :)

I won't pretend to have the answer for you Lucio...but it's a scenario many artists face. I think whatever you choose to do and to practically support yourself...most important, make sure you're happy with your life. :nod:
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
thanks man. what you said is the important thing to keep in mind indeed. in the end of the day you just have to stop and think: am i happy living like this?
most people don´t really stop and ask themselves that.
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:iconbarefootliam:
barefootliam Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008
I do know some professional full-time artists who live in our (rural) area.

A lot of it is clearly about self-promotion, about advertising, about getting pieces out there and seen, and about calling galleries and agencies.

These days a lot of it is about having high rankings in web searches (but don't be fooled by "black-hat" SEO companies who will take money from you, you can get good ranking without paying anyone).

For my own part I work in Web standardisation, at W3C, and if it doesn't entirely pay the bills, it comes close. We try and make up the rest by having ads on my Web pages.

My husband is an artist, but not yet earning a significant income; he might, one day, or he might not, it's impossible to say.

We went around the unbelievably huge One of a Kind show in Toronto (I think it's 8Km of booths), and saw artists whose paintings are already all sold by the end of the first day. At prices in the tens of thousands of dollars each.

So it's possible. In Canada the collectors go for strong colours and like big oil paintings best. Here in Britain they also value detailed work and engravings, so it varies.

See if there is an art appraiser near you and ask if you can chat over lunch about what sort of piece can sell; they seem to be the best people to ask. The down side is doing commercial art, and the up side is that after you're established, you can do more of what you want to do rather than what people buy.

Hope this helps.

Liam
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
yeah, that´s what i think sometimes, that there´s no harm doing what people want at first and then following your own path when you´re more established. the problem is that many people turn out to do the former for the rest of their career and i know people who did.

people love cityscapes around here, my major commissions were cityscapes.

i feel bad for complaining because my life is in fact pretty easy and that´s exactly why i´m complaining, because i never really had to submit myself too much to the system. so yeah, i´ll just do what i have to do.

thanks for the interest ;)
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:iconbarefootliam:
barefootliam Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008
Just don't wear shoes unless you have to, and everything else will be fine :D :D

Liam
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
can i wear sandals? that´s what i´m wearing now.
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:iconbarefootliam:
barefootliam Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008
No. :D
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 16, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
hum.. ok, i´ll try, maybe your on to something.
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:iconbarefootliam:
barefootliam Featured By Owner Oct 16, 2008
:D
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 16, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
i did it today.. it was very nice. it rained!
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(1 Reply)
:iconmartywolf92:
Martywolf92 Featured By Owner Oct 14, 2008
a hard issue to talk about. I for one dont have a clue. I normally have advice but i cant think of much at this moment. Just do what you feel best.
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:iconclassina:
classina Featured By Owner Oct 14, 2008
Hold on to your dreams and live them Lucio. Here's an excerpt from my biography which I'm still writing (real names were changed):

"The dreams which Guy and Beth had shared were so far in the past. He became the classic breadwinner who was gone from five in the morning until seven at night, and she the homemaker, taking on the roles of both mother and father. They seemed to be locked in. Cast and fired in the oven. The supple clay which they were once formed of, took a permanent form, a fragility. Beth could not seem to find the time to pursue her passion. At least that was what she told herself and everyone else. Secretly she was full of fear. Having a home and family to care for allowed the excuses she employed.
Dreams they shared long ago of becoming self sufficient in a rural community, became buried under Guy's hour commute to Boston and small children in need of nurturing. They abandoned dreams for financial security. Goals set to raise the children holistically were downtrodden by fast foods and quick fixes."

Hope that wasn't too long but we once shared a dream to become self sufficient and live off the grid. A times I think it would have been easier to be a painter that way.
But to answer your question. . .I do make money painting but not a living. Gary (my husband) makes most of the money. When I seriously started selling my work I thought I could make enough money to allow him to find a passion although he IS an engineer and enjoys it. Well that didn't happen yet but I'm not giving up.
The competition is fierce out there but it doesn't necessarily mean that the "best" painters are the ones making the money. I recently bought a book called "I'd Rather Be in the Studio" and it has a lot of practical advice on you guessed it - self-promotion. I'm trying to follow the suggestions and I hate to but I do want to make money selling my work to free my husband a bit. Or maybe I DO want recognition. hmmm
I know one thing. . . I can paint and I don't have the drive to do anything else. When I paint I'm transported to a place of calm and stillness - even when I have a challenge that's difficult to resolve.

Keep following your passion in your lifestyle and work. It will all fall into place. . .it will just take time.
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
thank you for sharing your writing... it was very significant and poignant.
i know what the need for stability does, and having children must change everything indeed.
it´s sad to see the options we have these days, because we don´t have much freedom to choose between different lifestyles, there are few left.
there´s not a lot of people around to teach me about nature, i don´t know anyone who would know how to raise a child off the grid as you put it. or doing anything off the grid for that matter. no one around knows much about the plants around here. how to use them, how to grow them.
people are heading to the cities and forgetting everything they knew.
your story reminded me of a friend i have whose husband also works a lot while she tries to develop her art. they just got married and she worked as well but stopped to try to paint more and make some money from it. and if it´s hard for me who was born in a family of artists, i can imagine how it is for her.
with that in mind, yes, i could work harder and i will. but images of a different world come to my mind, where money is not so essential. so how can we ditch money? that´s what i´m thinking about, and it does require a great mindset change. the attachment we have on all material things for example must be dealt with, because the more attached you are to those things, the less free you are. i´m still attached to a lot of things, and the more i live, more things i have. how can i move freely if i have so much weight on my shoulders? i can´t.
i´m not saying i´ll leave everything and join a group of indians in the amazon, but the more you work out those things, the more you can be free to just be. to be you. to live and nothing more.
i wanted to tell my friend her husband works too much (he´s my friend too now) but how can i? and his work is very tiring. they don´t have time to stay together and he gets home exhausted. but as i said and as you know we don´t have too many options. what would i suggest to them? "stop working" and then what? stop spending? have a more modest lifestyle? don´t have kids? don´t travel? be an artist as well? ha!
i will do what i have to do. i will make exhibits, i will contact galleries, i will paint marketable pieces. but i will do that to buy my freedom. each good sale i do maintains me and my girlfriend for half a year or more (i did make some really good sales in the past). i´ll just have to do more marketing to keep that going but still try to keep most of my free time. my goal is actually not much different from how i live now. that´s why i don´t have a goal.

thanks for your help, i needed it.

cheers ria!
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:iconlivin-a-life:
livin-a-life Featured By Owner Oct 14, 2008
if you figure it out let me know,

i have to work at a local hospital to make my money.
i do sell the odd piece, but it is never enough to sustain for long. people dont want to shell out their hard earned money on an unknown artist's work.

like you i dont really like the business side of the art world, but i love painting. i keep wishing for that lottery win so i can just paint without worrying about money.
until that happens i will continue to work and continue to paint, hoping it come together at some point
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 14, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
that´s what bothers me: you HAVE to work in...
i think we should do what we want and like to do and never submit ourselves. i´m trying to figure this out, but there are some things i already know: the first thing is trying not to spend money on things you don´t really need. that´s how the system gets us, it makes us think we want so many things we don´t need, and we spend all our money and so we have to work to buy them. that´s when you have to realize what are your real necessities and luxuries. i want to try to cut down my spendings, if you don´t spend much you don´t need to earn much.
second thing: try to plant edible plants, so i don´t depend so much on money or the marketplace to eat. also trying to recognize edible plants from the surroundings, which i´m starting to do and it´s really rewarding. finding a source of natural clear water is also important, and i´m making progress in that area, my neighbors already do that so i only need to connect a hose to theirs and bring it here. then i won´t have to pay for water and it will be even cleaner without all the chemicals the water department uses to "purify" the water. a way to heat up the shower water without the use of electricity is also important.
those are just some steps in a sustainable direction, but any step you take even small ones makes a difference for the natural world and for your freedom ;)
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:iconlivin-a-life:
livin-a-life Featured By Owner Oct 15, 2008
i agree, we shouldn't have to do things we dont like just to be able to live.
your on the right track with the self sustaining lifestyle,

i love watching Ray Mears on tv. he goes off into various countries and lives with the native people and tribes and finds out how they live and survive in the wilderness.
its really interesting to see people who live in the jungle and are happy and content with the lifestyle

we, as a society, are too soft.
we are used to other people providing for us,
our heat, light, water, food, entertainment,etc
its these people that hold us in their tallons, control us, and get rich of us.
there is not one politician who is short of money, and they are supposed to work for us (so they say), so as their bosses, why are we bearing the brunt of their mistakes while they sit in luxury.

i'll stop before i get on a rant.

i am trying to cut down on my luxuries,
seeing as i am moving soon i want to reduce as much as possible.
for me the main luxury is technology,
i love computers, games, gadgets, etc
i have a cd collection to rival the major stores.
but when i look around at what i have, i dont feel content, i dont feel happy,
i dont crave more stuff, i just dont feel happy.

i keep having these day dreams, where i am a nomad, traveling from place to place, country to country, living of whatever i can get my hands on, being free
i like those day dreams.
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:icontamino:
tamino Featured By Owner Oct 17, 2008  Professional Traditional Artist
i was very glad to read your response.
i didn´t imagine you also felt like that.

what you said about other people providing for us, that´s one of the main issues i worry about. we don´t know how to do anything anymore! anything essential for survival i mean.
yes, and that´s why we are entirely in their hands.

what you wrote is very well put! i´ll even quote it because you took the words right out of my mouth:

"we, as a society, are too soft.
we are used to other people providing for us,
our heat, light, water, food, entertainment,etc
its these people that hold us in their tallons, control us, and get rich of us.
there is not one politician who is short of money, and they are supposed to work for us (so they say), so as their bosses, why are we bearing the brunt of their mistakes while they sit in luxury."

and yes, i also don´t feel happy about the things i have. i think i do, but it´s the other way around. i think it´s more like a weight i have to carry. take care of, sustain, clean, maintain.

we´ll surely talk more about this questions ok? cause these daydreams of yours seem very real to me!
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